Speaker 1
Hello and welcome to Ask the Mayor on WFIU. I'm Joe Hren. This week, we're with Bloomington Mayor Kerry Thomson at City Hall. Hello, welcome.
Kerry Thomson
Hi, Joe. Thanks for coming back.
Speaker 1
Always a pleasure. You know, a month ago, we were on Zoom at the Democratic National Convention. I'm sure exciting time for you. But one thing that you said, and I'm sure we'll always be talking about, is housing. That's
Kerry Thomson
right. Housing has been top of my agenda for three decades now, and Bloomington continues to be the least affordable place to live in the state of Indiana. And so we, we are focused here on housing, but on the national radar, it's risen to the top of nearly every mayor's list, and so the US Conference of Mayors will be focusing on housing for the next year.
Speaker 1
So budget hearings at least. Week one complete. So now what comes next? Yes,
Kerry Thomson
so So week one, which really feels like a month for all of us who are at the budget hearings every night. But those are the those are the lengthy presentations and Q and A's about what's what's really in the details of the budget. We've had conversations with individual council members about their priorities, and feel like we're really in a good collaborative space. And this was really an important moment for a new administration and a new council. Frankly, we can talk about priorities all we want. We can agree, we can disagree, but the rubber really hits the road in collaboration when you have to put together a budget, and I would say that that we have, I hope, gained a lot of trust in this process. We've had the hard conversations, we have prioritized, and I think we've come together with a really good product for our community. If
Speaker 1
I remember, right? It's usually October when it's finalized and sent to the state and so forth, right?
Kerry Thomson
Yeah, final. Final is actually November, but, but, yes, we have two more hearings, and there'll be a probably some discussion at each of those but, but the bulk of the the work on the budget has been done.
Speaker 1
I wanted to ask you about the HT had a story yesterday about city revenues, almost $59 million how much is the general fund budget?
Kerry Thomson
That is a great question in this year's budget. I think we're at about 83 I should know the answer, yeah, but, I
Speaker 1
mean, so sorry, no, but, but, but about that? Yes. And so the interesting point to the story was, was having, you know, almost, I mean, two thirds of that in reserves. Where did all that money come from? Is that normal?
Kerry Thomson
We have, we've taken only 10 million actually out of reserves. And part of the reason that we did that is because, is because, frankly, our our reserves were so significant, and because we have a big push this particular year, and so that push is to really come into executing on the wage and salary survey that was done to get our city pay up to something close to market, and really to be competitive, because we have jobs that we're unable to fill, and we're having retention problems without that. So that includes both. So the survey was done on non union employees, and so the union employees, though, we have already had a successful negotiation with fire, so they are, they're now going to be caught up, and then we're moving in with police as well.
Speaker 1
And I mean, of course, it sounds like a good problem to have the city has too much money sitting in reserves. But where did that like? How did that come to be?
Kerry Thomson
It's been accumulated over the past several years, and so, you know, we have, we have the operating budget. We'll use 10 million of reserves there. We also have the ability to bond for different things. And my goal as mayor is really to look at the strategic way that we can use different funds. And so, you know, we have our redevelopment fund. We have TIF funds, etc, etc, and so we want to be really strategic with our money. We also don't want to overtax the public. Bloomington actually has one of the lowest tax rates in the state of Indiana, so we're doing really well with that right now, but my administration wants to ensure that we're just making the absolute best use of every resource we can, and taking 10 million out of those reserves really leaves us still with a very healthy, healthy reserve for rainy day, etc.
Speaker 1
Yeah. I mean, that's kind of where I was going with this. We know we had Mr. Course, previous administration had raised taxes. And so the question was, you know, is Bloomington? Are Bloomington residents being taxed too much if the city has that much money?
Kerry Thomson
Yeah, so there. So, you know, my my feeling is that we're not being taxed too much, but we need to use those reserves really wisely and then continue to only spend what we need in tax for what we need. And so we do, we have the operating fund, and we'll use 10 million of reserves. Then we're talking with council about what will go in a bond, and that may be up to another ten million of bonds. So that's where you get the difference between 64 and 83 so
Speaker 1
I drove past the fire station recently. Renovations look pretty close.
Kerry Thomson
We're ahead of schedule on that, and it's looking great. We're really excited, and we will be announcing a grand opening when we have a final, final date, but it's yet to come this fall.
Speaker 1
So the fire station will move back from that, the strip mall, the bunker and Robertson property to the downtown facility. That's right, yes. And fire headquarters will move here to City Hall, yes.
Kerry Thomson
And that really is we're painting in that space now. So administration is, you know, the showers West property is ready to host them. Really could be ready in the next week or so. They'll move at the same time. So we're looking forward to that grand opening, and of course, there'll be a grand opening at the forge sometime around the 22nd of November. So lots of exciting things happening,
Unknown Speaker
any progress on the police station renovation?
Kerry Thomson
So we're looking at the various options for the police station renovation is on the table. That's a tricky site to renovate, but we also are looking at alternative spaces for that.
Speaker 1
I see the annex of Bloomington, the city's newest workforce housing development from the annex group just had a grand opening. What does that provide? And how does this help the market?
Kerry Thomson
So the annex is one of the market rate properties that has incorporated some workforce housing into their property, and that workforce housing is offered to people at a certain area median income, certain percentage of our area median income and and those units can only be offered to people within that income segment. And as rents in the annex are escalating, they'll escalate every year by a certain amount, those workforce units will stay stable. What we need is more creative solutions for how to provide workforce and affordable units, middle income units, to people who work in Bloomington and so this is one way developers can help and still meet a pro forma for a market rate development so they can still rent to those grad students or undergrad students, and make those market rate rents and guarantee our community that they're going to put some of the units into workforce. So
Speaker 1
what's the difference between then workforce and market rate?
Kerry Thomson
So the workforce units are targeted toward to an income level, and my hope would be that then the rents actually will be also reduced there as as this unit, this development has come on. I did ask the question yesterday, what is the rent in the workforce units? They're able to actually charge market for those workforce units? I would argue that means that we probably haven't hit the mark, and we would want those workforce units to really be guaranteed to people that otherwise couldn't enter the market.
Speaker 1
Now I wanted to because we've had this on the show the last two times with in Terre Haute and Columbus. About the new Dora districts that are going around the state. I think there are 27 municipalities that now have one, and it's the where you can new Indiana law allows patrons to walk around with alcoholic beverages in a designated area to enhance tourism. Is this something Bloomington is interested in or looking at? We
Kerry Thomson
may look at it. Bloomington, of course, is a very different community than Terre Haute and Columbus, but it could really enhance, for instance, if we're looking at area around the convention center, it could enhance that area. And we want to be really aware that we also have a significant student population, and look at the regulations concerning who is carrying that alcohol and what the sources of the alcohol are.
Speaker 1
I know I was at well. We were both at the CIB public meeting session last. Night at the at the convention center, and no, I've been following the convention center process for for years. Then we're in the design process is happening. Three hotel developers are looking in that area. So the question that I have for you would be all three of those hotel developers that talked about some type of public private partnership so that could be negotiations about a parking garage use or green space requirements the size of a ballroom or land, and we know there's really no set place yet where this hotel could go. So how much is the city interested or looking at being part of a private, public relationship with the potential hotel developer.
Kerry Thomson
So you know, my leadership is interested in making the convention center and its hotel a success. And the CIB, it's in the Interlocal the CIB will be selecting the hotelier for the convention center project, and then, based on who that is, they'll have their probably list of ways that the city might be able to help, or the county might be able to help. I think it may depend on what property they are looking at and what funds they're looking to tap, but we will be, will be eager to support a new hotel. We think it's critical for both the success of the convention center, but also tourism, generally downtown and so. So I'm a supporter of the convention center in general, and really eager to see what this what the hotelier is, and then we'll engage with conversations with them.
Speaker 1
Yeah, still, in an early portion of that process, the thing I grabbed John really quickly after last night was just to ask him about the parking it seems like you know you're talking about 2000 people eating having dinner. There where 2000 people going to park? Is that something that the city is worried about, or thinking about too
Kerry Thomson
well, if you're asking, if I'm worried about it, I am there. Are differing opinions on council about about parking in general. Anytime you have a place that is that you know can serve that many people, and we want to attract those people here, they're probably going to put their head in the bed overnight more often than not. So we need a hotel, and we need ways to get them here. And while all 2000 of them may not drive here, you know, we're going to support public transit, etc, etc, we will need significant parking, and I don't think that it's all going to be taken care of with the Fourth Street garage, which already, frankly, is, is partially full every single day. I
Speaker 1
was wondering about that. I was going to ask if there were any, any data on the use of that garage. But it's, it's pretty full, huh?
Kerry Thomson
Yeah, I think that it's, it's somewhere around two thirds full, you know, on on weekdays anyway. And, you know, we want to, we want to maximize that parking obviously, but the other thing that we need to acknowledge is that the convention center is going east on a surface parking lot. So that parking lot will be eliminated and so and that lot is full every day, every working day. So we we're going to have other displaced parking for our downtown. And you know, we're looking at a downtown circulator for shopping downtown and and getting around downtown, those folks will want to park in a garage, and so we need to have some realistic solutions. See
Speaker 1
a lot of road construction downtown running on College Avenue. Why is that being done now and not during the summertime, when there's less football and school traffic and things like that? Yeah, so
Kerry Thomson
we so our streets program has a schedule for when we do all of these things, and it's based on on both when we can get to it and when it's most practical. What's happening right now on college is actually not street construction. We are doing ADA compliance on some of those sidewalk aprons. And, you know, pedestrian walkways, so Sixth Street is next. While it might have been ideal to do that during the summer, we had a very significant project on Indiana Avenue. And you know that disruption would have been. Worse to have that going on through the fall
Speaker 1
before we leave, we always ask people if they want to email in questions. And we had John email in. He had a couple after we spoke last month about annexation. Sure, he had a couple follow up questions. And I would like to get these in really quick. He wants to ask about if you've changed your take on annexation, from when you were campaigning to to now. It seems like, before you were mayor, that you were against annexation. Now you are more adamantly for it. Have you changed?
Kerry Thomson
I was I, I I am still not a proponent of how annexation was approached. I think we really needed a more open dialog. We needed to welcome people into the city. We still do if annexation happens, and unfortunately, those conversations didn't happen at the get go in an ideal world, frankly, annexation would have happened incrementally over really the last 20 years. That didn't happen either. I am a proponent of annexation now, because the data is very clear and the patterns of of economic stability are very clear. A city with no elasticity in its boundaries, both the city and the county go into economic decline. And so we really are at a point where, if you know that, if we if the tide rises, the whole all the all the boats in the ocean come with it. And so economically, this is a benefit for both the county and the city, and so I am actively looking for ways to engage with county residents who would like their questions answered. Some of those have been showing up at my town halls and at my traveling office hours. That is a great place to come. Also happy to meet with people in other venues.
Speaker 1
Last question, as mayor, former executive of Habitat for Humanity, would not make sense to override the prohibition on extending sewers on an ad hoc basis, like a nonprofit could build affordable housing in a non city area while
Kerry Thomson
we you know, I'm pro housing, of course, the fact of the matter is that extending city services outside of city limits really puts all of our infrastructure under roads that we don't maintain. It is at more cost to the city to do that and to maintain those and with an outlook that we will essentially be landlocked, we're not going to continue to extend the geographic footprint of our city services, because we need to make sure that we are ensuring the very Best services for people within the city of limits.
Speaker 1
We have one minute left, so I always like to leave that to you, any announcements or anything else going on that we need to know about.
Kerry Thomson
Well, I'm I'm really excited about what's ahead for our community, especially in the trades district, with the trades and the convention center really developing in tandem. What's happening at the trades district is really attracting a lot of attention from businesses who want to be here and and so we are. We're actively partnering with the CIB in talking about really activating the Beeline between between the convention center and trades, but especially first around that convention center area and then really creating a dynamic live, work, play environment along the Beeline. That
Speaker 1
was one of the things mentioned at the CIAB last night from the public, is that activation the beeline to the convention center. That's going to be important too. It
Kerry Thomson
is because people who you know, people who come to conventions frequently, they don't come just for the conference. They come because of the place. And we are the number two convention location in the state of Indiana, and we have outdated convention center space, so we already know people are coming here because of Bloomington, and so we really need to help them enjoy all aspects of Bloomington while they're here, and getting them on the Beeline and, you know, walking right up to wonder lab to our downtown restaurants to trades district, it's all it's all part of the Bloomington experience. Thank
Unknown Speaker
you so much. Hope to see you next month. Thanks
Unknown Speaker
so much. Joe
Hello and welcome to Ask the Mayor on WFIU. I'm Joe Hren. This week, we're with Bloomington Mayor Kerry Thomson at City Hall. Hello, welcome.
Kerry Thomson
Hi, Joe. Thanks for coming back.
Speaker 1
Always a pleasure. You know, a month ago, we were on Zoom at the Democratic National Convention. I'm sure exciting time for you. But one thing that you said, and I'm sure we'll always be talking about, is housing. That's
Kerry Thomson
right. Housing has been top of my agenda for three decades now, and Bloomington continues to be the least affordable place to live in the state of Indiana. And so we, we are focused here on housing, but on the national radar, it's risen to the top of nearly every mayor's list, and so the US Conference of Mayors will be focusing on housing for the next year.
Speaker 1
So budget hearings at least. Week one complete. So now what comes next? Yes,
Kerry Thomson
so So week one, which really feels like a month for all of us who are at the budget hearings every night. But those are the those are the lengthy presentations and Q and A's about what's what's really in the details of the budget. We've had conversations with individual council members about their priorities, and feel like we're really in a good collaborative space. And this was really an important moment for a new administration and a new council. Frankly, we can talk about priorities all we want. We can agree, we can disagree, but the rubber really hits the road in collaboration when you have to put together a budget, and I would say that that we have, I hope, gained a lot of trust in this process. We've had the hard conversations, we have prioritized, and I think we've come together with a really good product for our community. If
Speaker 1
I remember, right? It's usually October when it's finalized and sent to the state and so forth, right?
Kerry Thomson
Yeah, final. Final is actually November, but, but, yes, we have two more hearings, and there'll be a probably some discussion at each of those but, but the bulk of the the work on the budget has been done.
Speaker 1
I wanted to ask you about the HT had a story yesterday about city revenues, almost $59 million how much is the general fund budget?
Kerry Thomson
That is a great question in this year's budget. I think we're at about 83 I should know the answer, yeah, but, I
Speaker 1
mean, so sorry, no, but, but, but about that? Yes. And so the interesting point to the story was, was having, you know, almost, I mean, two thirds of that in reserves. Where did all that money come from? Is that normal?
Kerry Thomson
We have, we've taken only 10 million actually out of reserves. And part of the reason that we did that is because, is because, frankly, our our reserves were so significant, and because we have a big push this particular year, and so that push is to really come into executing on the wage and salary survey that was done to get our city pay up to something close to market, and really to be competitive, because we have jobs that we're unable to fill, and we're having retention problems without that. So that includes both. So the survey was done on non union employees, and so the union employees, though, we have already had a successful negotiation with fire, so they are, they're now going to be caught up, and then we're moving in with police as well.
Speaker 1
And I mean, of course, it sounds like a good problem to have the city has too much money sitting in reserves. But where did that like? How did that come to be?
Kerry Thomson
It's been accumulated over the past several years, and so, you know, we have, we have the operating budget. We'll use 10 million of reserves there. We also have the ability to bond for different things. And my goal as mayor is really to look at the strategic way that we can use different funds. And so, you know, we have our redevelopment fund. We have TIF funds, etc, etc, and so we want to be really strategic with our money. We also don't want to overtax the public. Bloomington actually has one of the lowest tax rates in the state of Indiana, so we're doing really well with that right now, but my administration wants to ensure that we're just making the absolute best use of every resource we can, and taking 10 million out of those reserves really leaves us still with a very healthy, healthy reserve for rainy day, etc.
Speaker 1
Yeah. I mean, that's kind of where I was going with this. We know we had Mr. Course, previous administration had raised taxes. And so the question was, you know, is Bloomington? Are Bloomington residents being taxed too much if the city has that much money?
Kerry Thomson
Yeah, so there. So, you know, my my feeling is that we're not being taxed too much, but we need to use those reserves really wisely and then continue to only spend what we need in tax for what we need. And so we do, we have the operating fund, and we'll use 10 million of reserves. Then we're talking with council about what will go in a bond, and that may be up to another ten million of bonds. So that's where you get the difference between 64 and 83 so
Speaker 1
I drove past the fire station recently. Renovations look pretty close.
Kerry Thomson
We're ahead of schedule on that, and it's looking great. We're really excited, and we will be announcing a grand opening when we have a final, final date, but it's yet to come this fall.
Speaker 1
So the fire station will move back from that, the strip mall, the bunker and Robertson property to the downtown facility. That's right, yes. And fire headquarters will move here to City Hall, yes.
Kerry Thomson
And that really is we're painting in that space now. So administration is, you know, the showers West property is ready to host them. Really could be ready in the next week or so. They'll move at the same time. So we're looking forward to that grand opening, and of course, there'll be a grand opening at the forge sometime around the 22nd of November. So lots of exciting things happening,
Unknown Speaker
any progress on the police station renovation?
Kerry Thomson
So we're looking at the various options for the police station renovation is on the table. That's a tricky site to renovate, but we also are looking at alternative spaces for that.
Speaker 1
I see the annex of Bloomington, the city's newest workforce housing development from the annex group just had a grand opening. What does that provide? And how does this help the market?
Kerry Thomson
So the annex is one of the market rate properties that has incorporated some workforce housing into their property, and that workforce housing is offered to people at a certain area median income, certain percentage of our area median income and and those units can only be offered to people within that income segment. And as rents in the annex are escalating, they'll escalate every year by a certain amount, those workforce units will stay stable. What we need is more creative solutions for how to provide workforce and affordable units, middle income units, to people who work in Bloomington and so this is one way developers can help and still meet a pro forma for a market rate development so they can still rent to those grad students or undergrad students, and make those market rate rents and guarantee our community that they're going to put some of the units into workforce. So
Speaker 1
what's the difference between then workforce and market rate?
Kerry Thomson
So the workforce units are targeted toward to an income level, and my hope would be that then the rents actually will be also reduced there as as this unit, this development has come on. I did ask the question yesterday, what is the rent in the workforce units? They're able to actually charge market for those workforce units? I would argue that means that we probably haven't hit the mark, and we would want those workforce units to really be guaranteed to people that otherwise couldn't enter the market.
Speaker 1
Now I wanted to because we've had this on the show the last two times with in Terre Haute and Columbus. About the new Dora districts that are going around the state. I think there are 27 municipalities that now have one, and it's the where you can new Indiana law allows patrons to walk around with alcoholic beverages in a designated area to enhance tourism. Is this something Bloomington is interested in or looking at? We
Kerry Thomson
may look at it. Bloomington, of course, is a very different community than Terre Haute and Columbus, but it could really enhance, for instance, if we're looking at area around the convention center, it could enhance that area. And we want to be really aware that we also have a significant student population, and look at the regulations concerning who is carrying that alcohol and what the sources of the alcohol are.
Speaker 1
I know I was at well. We were both at the CIB public meeting session last. Night at the at the convention center, and no, I've been following the convention center process for for years. Then we're in the design process is happening. Three hotel developers are looking in that area. So the question that I have for you would be all three of those hotel developers that talked about some type of public private partnership so that could be negotiations about a parking garage use or green space requirements the size of a ballroom or land, and we know there's really no set place yet where this hotel could go. So how much is the city interested or looking at being part of a private, public relationship with the potential hotel developer.
Kerry Thomson
So you know, my leadership is interested in making the convention center and its hotel a success. And the CIB, it's in the Interlocal the CIB will be selecting the hotelier for the convention center project, and then, based on who that is, they'll have their probably list of ways that the city might be able to help, or the county might be able to help. I think it may depend on what property they are looking at and what funds they're looking to tap, but we will be, will be eager to support a new hotel. We think it's critical for both the success of the convention center, but also tourism, generally downtown and so. So I'm a supporter of the convention center in general, and really eager to see what this what the hotelier is, and then we'll engage with conversations with them.
Speaker 1
Yeah, still, in an early portion of that process, the thing I grabbed John really quickly after last night was just to ask him about the parking it seems like you know you're talking about 2000 people eating having dinner. There where 2000 people going to park? Is that something that the city is worried about, or thinking about too
Kerry Thomson
well, if you're asking, if I'm worried about it, I am there. Are differing opinions on council about about parking in general. Anytime you have a place that is that you know can serve that many people, and we want to attract those people here, they're probably going to put their head in the bed overnight more often than not. So we need a hotel, and we need ways to get them here. And while all 2000 of them may not drive here, you know, we're going to support public transit, etc, etc, we will need significant parking, and I don't think that it's all going to be taken care of with the Fourth Street garage, which already, frankly, is, is partially full every single day. I
Speaker 1
was wondering about that. I was going to ask if there were any, any data on the use of that garage. But it's, it's pretty full, huh?
Kerry Thomson
Yeah, I think that it's, it's somewhere around two thirds full, you know, on on weekdays anyway. And, you know, we want to, we want to maximize that parking obviously, but the other thing that we need to acknowledge is that the convention center is going east on a surface parking lot. So that parking lot will be eliminated and so and that lot is full every day, every working day. So we we're going to have other displaced parking for our downtown. And you know, we're looking at a downtown circulator for shopping downtown and and getting around downtown, those folks will want to park in a garage, and so we need to have some realistic solutions. See
Speaker 1
a lot of road construction downtown running on College Avenue. Why is that being done now and not during the summertime, when there's less football and school traffic and things like that? Yeah, so
Kerry Thomson
we so our streets program has a schedule for when we do all of these things, and it's based on on both when we can get to it and when it's most practical. What's happening right now on college is actually not street construction. We are doing ADA compliance on some of those sidewalk aprons. And, you know, pedestrian walkways, so Sixth Street is next. While it might have been ideal to do that during the summer, we had a very significant project on Indiana Avenue. And you know that disruption would have been. Worse to have that going on through the fall
Speaker 1
before we leave, we always ask people if they want to email in questions. And we had John email in. He had a couple after we spoke last month about annexation. Sure, he had a couple follow up questions. And I would like to get these in really quick. He wants to ask about if you've changed your take on annexation, from when you were campaigning to to now. It seems like, before you were mayor, that you were against annexation. Now you are more adamantly for it. Have you changed?
Kerry Thomson
I was I, I I am still not a proponent of how annexation was approached. I think we really needed a more open dialog. We needed to welcome people into the city. We still do if annexation happens, and unfortunately, those conversations didn't happen at the get go in an ideal world, frankly, annexation would have happened incrementally over really the last 20 years. That didn't happen either. I am a proponent of annexation now, because the data is very clear and the patterns of of economic stability are very clear. A city with no elasticity in its boundaries, both the city and the county go into economic decline. And so we really are at a point where, if you know that, if we if the tide rises, the whole all the all the boats in the ocean come with it. And so economically, this is a benefit for both the county and the city, and so I am actively looking for ways to engage with county residents who would like their questions answered. Some of those have been showing up at my town halls and at my traveling office hours. That is a great place to come. Also happy to meet with people in other venues.
Speaker 1
Last question, as mayor, former executive of Habitat for Humanity, would not make sense to override the prohibition on extending sewers on an ad hoc basis, like a nonprofit could build affordable housing in a non city area while
Kerry Thomson
we you know, I'm pro housing, of course, the fact of the matter is that extending city services outside of city limits really puts all of our infrastructure under roads that we don't maintain. It is at more cost to the city to do that and to maintain those and with an outlook that we will essentially be landlocked, we're not going to continue to extend the geographic footprint of our city services, because we need to make sure that we are ensuring the very Best services for people within the city of limits.
Speaker 1
We have one minute left, so I always like to leave that to you, any announcements or anything else going on that we need to know about.
Kerry Thomson
Well, I'm I'm really excited about what's ahead for our community, especially in the trades district, with the trades and the convention center really developing in tandem. What's happening at the trades district is really attracting a lot of attention from businesses who want to be here and and so we are. We're actively partnering with the CIB in talking about really activating the Beeline between between the convention center and trades, but especially first around that convention center area and then really creating a dynamic live, work, play environment along the Beeline. That
Speaker 1
was one of the things mentioned at the CIAB last night from the public, is that activation the beeline to the convention center. That's going to be important too. It
Kerry Thomson
is because people who you know, people who come to conventions frequently, they don't come just for the conference. They come because of the place. And we are the number two convention location in the state of Indiana, and we have outdated convention center space, so we already know people are coming here because of Bloomington, and so we really need to help them enjoy all aspects of Bloomington while they're here, and getting them on the Beeline and, you know, walking right up to wonder lab to our downtown restaurants to trades district, it's all it's all part of the Bloomington experience. Thank
Unknown Speaker
you so much. Hope to see you next month. Thanks
Unknown Speaker
so much. Joe
