Micah Beckwith (Devan Ridgway/WTIU News)
As part of WTIU/WFIU News’ 2024 election coverage, reporter Ethan Sandweiss invited the two candidates for Indiana Lieutenant Governor.
The candidates are Democrat Terry Goodin and Republican Micah Beckwith.
The interview with Terry Goodin can be found here.
Ethan Sandweiss
You’re also from Indiana?
Micah Beckwith
I grew up in Southern Michigan, but then went to school in Huntington. It was Huntington College at the time, and then now I live in Noblesville.
Ethan Sandweiss
What brought you to Noblesville?
Micah Beckwith
Well, I met my wife. She was, you know, the love of my life in college, and we met. She's from Noblesville, that's where she grew up. And so, when we got married, we moved there just to be close to her family. I was traveling a lot with my work at the time, and so I wanted her to be close to friends and family.
Ethan Sandweiss
So usually, lieutenant governor is not a particularly contentious race. I think a lot of people see it as a ceremonial position. But you threw your hat in the ring even though you were not Braun or Trump's preferred candidate for this race. What got you motivated?
Micah Beckwith
I think I saw kind of gap in the system. Like, here's an office, the lieutenant governor’s office is constitutionally created office. It's the people's office. I'm a constitutionalist. I've always loved the constitutional history, American history, and for me, the people own the office, not a politician. So, what we've done, traditionally, over the last 30 to 40 years in Indiana is we've given away that office to a politician, to give to his or her friend or for whatever reason, you know, that we've just kind of said ‘Here, politician, you can, you can give that away.’ To me, that was the problem. I said, ‘Well, it's not a politician's to give away.’ It’s the people's to choose. And so, I threw my hat in the ring for the nomination, and, you know, the delegates like the message, and they put me in there. And so, I think we're getting back to kind of the right order, where it belongs to the people, but the people decide the ticket, and then we run together in the general.
Ethan Sandweiss
Like I mentioned before, Donald Trump threw in a late endorsement for state rep, Julie McGuire as the lieutenant governor. Why do you think he endorsed that particular candidate?
Micah Beckwith
Well, I don't think he knew either one of us. I think it was probably a little bit of a political game, right? I think there were some favors that were called in, and that's OK. I think the system was stacked against me. And, you know, I have a deep faith. Obviously, I love the Lord with all my heart. And sometimes God will stack the system against people specifically so that he can show the world this is his hand, and nobody else's. So I think when Donald Trump came out against me — well, not against me, but for my opponent. And then you had, you had pretty much every establishment figure in Indiana supporting Julie McGuire. By the way, Julie's a great rep. She's a conservative rep. She really is a solid servant of the people. So there's no ill will towards Julie, but I think the Lord just allowed it to go that way, so he could say, ‘I get the glory on this. This wasn't Micah, this wasn't any politician. This was not Donald Trump.’ This was God's hand moving and directing the waters. And I just, I think that's why, that's why it turned out the way it did.
Ethan Sandweiss
So [the Indiana] Capital Chronicle got a hold of this memo from inside the Braun campaign written by conservative attorney Jim Bopp, which basically said that some of your previous statements about Jan. 6 could be a liability to Braun’s campaign in the general election. What do you think about it?
Micah Beckwith
I don't think it's a liability at all. I think it taps into what the grassroots has been saying all along. I mean, the mainstream media has made Jan. 6 into something that it was not at all. Was it vandalism? Absolutely. Did I like to see what I saw? No, I didn't like any of what I saw that day. But it was not an insurrection. It was so far from an insurrection. And so I've just spoken out and said, ‘Listen, don't let these words get misconstrued. This was Donald Trump's fault.’ I mean, he said, ‘Go and peacefully protest.’ [They] didn't kill anybody. There was no death on the other side, there was a protester that got killed by the police. So, I mean, that was heartbreaking to see. However, I think what I'm seeing on the campaign trail is that it's not a liability at all. Everything that I'm doing is actually, I think, breathing life into the energy of the ticket. Mike Braun is going to be a great governor. He's got a lot of amazing business acumen and prowess, and he's going to take our state into a really great direction when it comes to efficiencies and making sure that the government's working for the people better than it has been. And I think what I'm doing is adding a lot of energy to that grassroots, to the base and people really are resonating with the message and loving it.
Ethan Sandweiss
I think there's been a lot of concern, especially from Republicans, that the next election is not going to be fair. There's been claims that undocumented immigrants are going to be voting in mass. Do you think this is something that's going to happen?
Micah Beckwith
I think we always have to be concerned, right? I think a healthy concern when it comes to our elections is good, because we want to make sure they're free and they're fair, right? We want to make sure that people who have a right to vote, get to vote in them, and they can vote in them. And we also want to make sure that the world's not voting in our elections. We're not a one world globalist nation. We are the sovereign United States of America. And so I think in Indiana, everything I've seen as I travel the state, talking to county clerks, people who are on election boards, ‘Hey, how does it look in your counties?’ Most of the time it's, it's, ‘Hey, it's pretty good.’ Like, we've got a pretty secure election set up in Indiana Now, what's going on in other parts of the country? I think I have some big concerns. So if you want to talk about national elections, what I see in Pennsylvania, they've got some big issues in Pennsylvania with their universal mail-in balloting. I mean, France used to do universal mail-in balloting. They got rid of it 45 years ago because it was so wrought with fraud. And here we are in the United States pushing that. And some states are saying, ‘We want this. We're just going to send out live ballots to charities, nonprofits, and just let them distribute these live ballots,’ and you have no idea who's filling them out. And so, I think there's certainly some concerns I have nationally. But in Indiana, I think we've done some really good work to make sure our elections are secure. But we can't fall asleep at the wheel either.
Ethan Sandweiss
If after the general election, Donald Trump ended up losing the election bid, and Braun or yourself ended up losing the election bid, would you accept those results?
Micah Beckwith
Certainly. If I thought they were free and fair, right? I mean, if Trump lost, if we lost free and fairly, then absolutely. The question that I have is, we need to be able to know that it's a fair and honest election. And I think after seeing what we've seen over the last few years, there's some serious red flags in other states. Again, I think Indiana is pretty solid. I'm not— I don't have any major concerns that I'm going to see the results on election night in Indiana and think, ‘Oh, man, somebody's been tampering with things.’ But I think we'll have to wait to see what happens in the national level. But as long as they're free, as long as they're honest, as long as it's upright, then, then I'm good with whatever the results are.
Ethan Sandweiss
You mentioned that you would be a check and balance on the governor when you're elected. Like we were talking about before, lieutenant governor, historically, has been a little bit more ceremonial. How do you see your influence playing out in the statehouse?
Micah Beckwith
Yeah, I think influence is a good word, because I think that's really what I'm good at, is taking a message and influencing people toward what I believe is true, what I think is true, what the Constitution lays out is true. And I think the check and balance is really a last resort. I'm not going in there to say, ‘Hey Mike Braun, I'm going to fight you at every turn.’ That was never my intention. And I did not get into the lieutenant governor race because of Mike Braun, or actually any one of the other gubernatorial primary candidates in the Republican side. I just saw a lack of accountability over the last six to eight years in Indiana governance, and I thought the lieutenant governor could be one more voice for the people in that state house, fighting for the people. And as a pastor, I've been standing up for people. I've been fighting for their liberties, fighting for their freedoms to do what they believe is best for them and their family when it comes to health care freedom, medical freedom, making sure that the government's not going to come in and tell them what to do. And so people just said, ‘Would you get into the state house and fight for us there too?’ So, I think, again, Mike Braun is going to do a great job. I don't have any concerns that I'm going to have to play this big check and balance to Mike Braun. Everything I've seen of him behind the scenes is he's limited government, he's efficient, he's effective, he's very conservative. So all those things are really giving me a lot of a lot of great excitement for the future. Now Indiana, because, to your point earlier, it's kind of a ceremonial position. Our lieutenant governor in Indiana — most people don't know this — from a statutory perspective, is one of the most robust LG offices in the entire country. With being the Secretary of [agriculture], overseeing OCRA [Indiana Office of Community and Rural Affairs], which is community economic development in small rural communities. You oversee housing and tourism, the civics education commission. I mean, there's a lot of responsibility that we give to the lieutenant governor in Indiana. So I think what I've done, in a good way, is kind of sort of open the eyes of Hoosiers all around the state to the fact that the LGs position is a really important position, and we should have a voice on who gets that nomination in Indiana. So I believe that people know what they're doing, and so I'm always going to fight to put the power in the hands of the people as much as much as we can.
Ethan Sandweiss
You were talking about a lack of accountability in the governor's office for the past eight years. I guess you're probably referring to Holcomb specifically. Any particular areas you would point to?
Micah Beckwith
Yeah, yeah. And Eric Holcomb is a fine man. This is not personal. From all accounts, people around him who know him say he's a really good person. I think what I saw in 2020 though, was an egregious overstep of government power in our lives. I mean labeling people essential, nonessential, forcing people to wear masks, forcing vaccination statuses, shutting down businesses and churches. These are things that you can make the argument whether they're good or bad. That's not what I'm talking about here. But these are things that the Constitution strictly forbids the government from doing, and yet our government was doing it. And I would go to our state reps and our state senators and say, ‘Hey, what are you doing? We can't because the governor has to call us back into session,’ and so from the executive branch, we just really dropped the ball. I think we were 22 months, 23 months in a constant state of emergency, when everybody knew we weren't in a state of emergency that long. It was just a way to get more FEMA funding, more federal dollars into our state, and everybody kind of knew it. So we're increasing the national debt for this false sense of emergency status. And so I think there was things like that. Governor Holcomb vetoed the women's sports bill that would keep biological men out of women's sports. And I mean, that was a really big, you know, problem in my in my book. Now the legislature did overturn his veto, so kudos to the legislature. But I think things like that, if I was lieutenant governor in years past, you would have heard my voice come out on those issues and be a champion for liberty for the people and making sure common sense policy is followed.
Ethan Sandweiss
You announced recently that you're putting together an advisory council for when you are in office. Mostly conservative, Christian voices. Could you talk a bit about what that would do, why you see that as necessary step?
Micah Beckwith
Yeah. Well, I mean, I think advisors are really good. I think it's wise to have counsel around you. I think anyone in office has good counsel. Whether it's people that they trust— and really, I wouldn't say it's all Christians. I mean, I know, I saw the report come out the other day where it was like, ‘He's putting together a group of dangerous Christians,’ or something like that. And I chuckled, because first of all, we're not like saying, ‘Hey, are you Christian? Come sit on this advisory board.’ But a lot of these people are conservative, and they know government. They have a history in government, and actually, there's even some that probably aren't super conservative, but they understand the system well. And I want people like that. And I have no problems with people who have different points of view. With me sitting on an advisory board, I want to hear all points of view. I want to be able to say, ‘Hey, just share openly and honestly what you think, and then collectively, let's see where the truth leads us.’ So that's really what it was. So I think that that story, I just kind of thought when it came out, I was like, man, who would have thought that that was actually a story. But just putting together people, surround myself with people who know what they're doing and have a good track record in government, doing some good, solid work for the people. So that's, what that advisory board really is designed to do.
Ethan Sandweiss
You describe yourself as a Christian nationalist before, put out a video that's on Facebook, three reasons why you should be a Christian nationalist. Could you explain a little bit what it means to be a Christian nationalist?
Micah Beckwith
So it's not what probably the mainstream media or the left think. I'm not a person who ever, in a million years, would ever advocate for a theocracy. I've never, never done that, nor do I think America should be that. America is a constitutional republic, and that's what we're founded as that. We are rooted in Judeo-Christian principles, though. And as a Christian, it is important for Christians to get involved in whatever nation God has placed them there. It's a stewardship issue. So to me, Christian nationalism is being a steward of what God has given you. So taking care of the nation, taking care of your community, being the hands and feet of Christ in your community. To me, Christianity is a good thing. Nationalism is a good thing, right? Like we want to serve our nation. The opposite of a nationalist is a globalist. Right. We don't want globalism. Globalism is not healthy. That strips us of our sovereignty and of our liberties. And so for me, I just don't play the word games with the left. They want to say Christian nationalism is bad thing. And they're turning it into something that it isn't. I'm saying, I'm not gonna let you take words like Christian and nationalism and now warp them so that everybody thinks that those are wrong. I just push back on that. Say, ‘Yeah, I love Christ and I love my nation, and if that makes me a Christian nationalist in your book, well, you know, so what?’
Ethan Sandweiss
What is the role of people who are religious minorities in the Christian nationalist America?
Micah Beckwith
Judeo-Christian principles doesn't mean that everybody has to be a Christian, right? We are rooted in Judeo-Christian principles in America. Our republic, the founders, they reference the Bible more than any other book. In our founding documents, Deuteronomy was referenced more than any other book of the Bible because Deuteronomy has to do with law, building a strong legal system. One that protects liberty, one that protects the government from growing too big and too fast. Anyone's welcome to be part of this amazing nation. I don't care if you're a Christian, atheist, Muslim, Hindu, whatever it is. But our foundations are our foundations for a reason, and Christian foundations have basically birth Western civilization, American history, world history, proves that. And so what I'm saying is, don't strip those foundations, because the moment you do, you're stripping the very thing that's protected you of government intrusion and tyranny in your life. Because really, God is the God of liberty. Our founders knew that. They said that they were all, I mean, the majority of them were very much Christ following Christians, and they went to Scripture to develop and to create this amazing Republic. We have a constitution that has lasted, what, 238, years. Now the average lifespan of a constitutional world history is 17 years. I would say that there was divine intervention that helped birth our nation. Ben Franklin said it. James Madison said it. Alexander Hamilton said it. Thomas Jefferson said it. Benjamin Rush, Noah Webster. I mean, all these men who had such an amazing grasp on World History crafted something that has stood the test of time, liberty around the world like we've never seen in world history. And so to me, that's what that means. Again, it's not saying that you know you have to worship a certain way. It's saying our foundations and our principles are good principles. They're rooted in Judeo-Christian, Christian ethic. Let's make sure that we keep those there. And because of that, we'll all have freedom and liberty to to be able to express ourselves how we want.
Ethan Sandweiss
Speaking of nationalism, I wanted to turn to immigration. There’s been a lot of stories coming out of Ohio about Haitian immigrants eating cats and dogs. This is something that you've talked about on your podcast. Do you think that's something that's happening?
Micah Beckwith
Well, I think illegal immigration is a big, big problem. I think it is happening that now, as far as eating cats and dogs, I have no idea. I mean, that was the story. I think it I don't who knows what to believe. You hear, you hear all kinds of things. I've seen body cam footage from police officers where it certainly looked like that was happening. But then come to find out, it was a goose or something like that. But either way, the point is, we have opened our borders. Biden Harris have opened up our borders. Borders. We're seeing an influx of migrants, Venezuelan and Haitian migrants in Indiana. I've talked to multiple law enforcement officials, whether it was down in Davies County, Hamilton County, Logansport, Cass County. I'm seeing all of these stories, and I'm talking to law enforcement and also citizens of those counties, and they're saying, ‘Yes, we are seeing that.’ We are seeing a huge uptick in people that don't have legal status here. It's causing a lot of problems. It's overrunning our school systems. It's overrunning our health care systems. And so we've got to get a handle on the illegal immigration problem. It really is a federal issue, but if the Feds won't do it, then the states have an obligation to do that and make sure that they're protecting our citizens here in Indiana.
Ethan Sandweiss
So what would that enforcement look like on a on a statewide scale?
Micah Beckwith
I think anything from making sure that we're contacting ICE when someone gets detained and they don't have legal status here, I think it's doing what Ron DeSantis or Governor Abbott did in Texas, where, if the federal government won't come and get them back into their to their homeland, their home nation, then we'll do it for them. We'll make sure that we are protecting the status of legal citizenship. And people will often say, ‘Hey, that's not loving to take an illegal immigrant and take them back to their home nation.’ I would argue it's unloving to do anything but that because you're not taking care of your community, you're not taking care of your kids. I know teachers in Hamilton County right now, they've got multiple phones out with multiple translating apps on their phone, trying to teach not only the legal citizens, the students that are there, but also these illegal immigrants that are in our school systems. And so you have teachers trying to teach and also translate into Ukrainian and into Spanish. And now what are we doing? We're forsaking our own children and a good education for them, because now we have to slow down everything that this teacher is teaching, because we've got a classroom full of naturalized born citizens, legal citizens and illegal immigrants. And so we can't continue this. This is insanity, and we have to put a stop to it. It needs to be the federal government and Biden-Harris, they have completely dropped the ball on that. I mean, even people on the left are acknowledging that now. I mean, it's not even a debate at this point. It is a complete dumpster fire when it comes to immigration in our country, and everybody knows it. So it's not hard to fix. We just have to have somebody in leadership to. Say we're gonna do the right thing.
Ethan Sandweiss
So should illegal immigrants be able to attend a public school?
Micah Beckwith
I don't think so, no. Because why are we taking our own resources and pulling them out of our kids, loving our kids, teaching our kids, training our kids, and trying to take care of the kids of the world? Listen, I want to be a good neighbor. I think we should all be good neighbors. I think America needs to be a good neighbor, but we cannot be a good neighbor when our when our when our nation is falling apart. I want to help nations like Haiti. I really do we. We send a lot of our charitable giving at our church to Haiti. We've given thousands of dollars to the crisis in Haiti, but we got to first make sure everything is good at home, or else we won't be able to be good neighbors to the world, and so if we don't get it right here, then we'll never be able to have the strength to get it to be a helping hand when the world needs us.
Ethan Sandweiss
Recently, you joined the board of trustees of the Hamilton East Public Library, and the board ordered this review of books that were in the teens section. I think Indy Star said it would cost somewhere around $300,000 to do that review. Do you think that teenagers and kids should be restricted in terms of what reading material they're able to access?
Micah Beckwith
Yeah, absolutely, as far as age-appropriate content. We've always had that right. So when you ask the question, should teenagers and kids be restricted? Yeah, we don't put pornographic material in in the purview of children, for a reason, right? My argument was always, we're not banning books. I never once called for a book ban on any book. It was just age-appropriate shelving. Is this content appropriate for a child? If it is, great, if it's not, let's get it over into the adult section. If mom and dad want to check out the book and show the kid later at home while, that's on them. I would certainly advise against that as a parent, but they can choose what they want to do. But as far as putting it in the public space in front of children, that's what we were doing. And it's fun when I have this conversation with leftists, when they say, ‘Oh, you're a book banner.’ I'll show them some of the images of books that we move to the adult section. I'll say, ‘You think a 13-year-old or a 12-year-old or eight-year-old should be able to access this every single time? Oh, well, not that. That's pretty egregious, that's pretty gross, that's pretty like graphic.’ Oh, so you agree with exactly what we did. Well, I mean, we don't want to ban books. Well, nobody's banning books. We just moved it to the adult section. So when you get down to what was going on, it was absolutely appropriate. It was just the left that has an agenda to sexualize children. They didn't like it, and so they came out, and they were screaming, and we stood up. We stood up to them and for good reason too, and we've made a lot of progress on that library board, and we now have seen a teen section created that has content that would be appropriate for teens, but maybe not for elementary students. That was one thing we were pushing for that finally got enacted. So that's good and but ultimately, it was never about banning books. No one was nobody was calling for a book ban. And so people say, ‘Ah, you want to ban books.’ I'm like, tell me what book I have ever called to be banned, and they can't because I haven't. But it is about keeping age-appropriate content in those sections and then putting inappropriate age content in the in the adult section.
Ethan Sandweiss
The 10th anniversary is coming up for a Supreme Court case that ruled that same sex couples are able to get married in any state in the United States. So I wanted to ask, do you believe that this has harmed society over the last 10 years?
Micah Beckwith
I think I've always called for civil unions, right? If somebody wants to, you know, say, ‘Hey, I love this one person. I want them to have a power of attorney, I want to be able to pass my things on to them.’ I don't if you're same sex or not same sex. The government doesn't have a right getting in the business of that. So I've always called for that. Marriage is divine, is defined by God. The reason I've always been against this idea of changing the definition of marriage is because man didn't define marriage, God did. And now you're taking the sacred, and you're taking it and defiling that. And so I've always held to you that marriage is sacred, and as a society I think we do better when we hold those things that are sacred, that are the traditional norms that, again, Judeo Christian principles are rooted in, that our nation is rooted in. We're going to see better outcomes. We're going to see stronger families. We're going to see we're going to see education stronger because of that. But I think ultimately, we have seen a decline in society over the last 10, 20 years. I don't think it's just that. I think there's a lot of reasons why that's happening, but I do think it's because we are chipping away at the at the traditional value system that has made America a strong a strong nation. We got to have strong families. And studies show time and time again that children grow to be more successful, to have all the things that they need, growing up when there's a mom and a dad in the home doesn't mean that two dads who are in a relationship can't be good dads, but they're gonna be terrible moms. So two moms who are in a relationship are sure going to be great moms, but they're not made to be dads. And so again, it goes back to those traditional values. And I, I defend those values because they work, and it really does make society a great place when those values are the gold standard.
Ethan Sandweiss
Should same sex partners be able to raise children?
Micah Beckwith
Absolutely, I don't this is not about a, oh, we're taking that right away. I'm just saying when we do it the way it was traditionally laid out by God to work, it works better. I think society's broken. I think there is a, there's certainly a place for students and children when they don't have a mom and dad, and there's a gay couple that wants to raise them, hey, that's better than the foster care system. I mean, the foster care system in Indiana is completely broke, but it's not the gold standard. What I've always said is make the gold standard the gold standard, and keep it there, and let's move society up, instead of bringing the standard down to where we have been going. And I think again, you look at our culture now, as opposed to 20, 30, 40 years ago, and it's a case study. I mean, you can see it, it is. It's going in a not good direction. I think most people can see it. They can sense it. They can feel it. And I think it's because we've been lowering the standards of what God said is right, true and virtuous. We've got to get back to that. And again, there's it doesn't mean that you're not welcome. Doesn't mean that you don't have a place in society if you have different, differing opinions. But don't lower the gold standard, because as you do, society will begin to break down as we're as we're seeing.
Ethan Sandweiss
So the government, in other words, has a role to step in and define what marriage is.
Micah Beckwith
I think they don't have they don't have a role to define what marriage is. They have a role to uphold what the definition of marriage is. So they never defined it. It's not governments to begin with. So you can't redefine it if you didn't define it in the first place. So they should have always just upheld what it once was and what it always has been. That's what government should do, defending what is true, what is right, what is virtuous, that's the role of government, protecting the rights of citizens, is the purpose of government. But government has to have an idea of what is morally true, what is what is virtuous, what is right and good, or else they're going to run off the rails just as quickly as any individual will, and nobody's going to know up from down or right from left.
Ethan Sandweiss
We've done a lot of coverage at this station in particular on the federal death penalty. There’s a Federal Penitentiary in Terre Haute where America's executions are carried out. Indiana itself is also about to carry out its first state execution since 2009. Wanted to ask, where do you stand on the death penalty? Do you think we should see it applied more broadly, or do you think it's something that we should do away with.
Micah Beckwith
Well, I think first of all the death penalty is a good thing. We got to remember that this is what puts fear into the hearts of evildoers, right? So Romans: 13 in scripture lays it out. It is the government's job to carry the sword. They do not carry the sword in vain. They put fear into the hearts of those who will do evil, those that would do things to you or your families, or your children and children's children that are wicked and evil. We don't want them to do those things. Well, how will we stop them unless they're afraid of the consequences? That's what the death penalty is for. That's one of the first laws God ever gave man is called the Noahide laws. When he told Noah, he said, ‘If you shed innocent blood, then by man's hand, will your blood be shed.’ And it was God saying, government has a job to protect life, protect the innocence of life. And if there are evildoers, if there are wolves that are going to come into the sheep's pasture, it's the job of the shepherd to kill the wolf, and so I very much support the death penalty. From that perspective, I will say this, there has to be an incredibly high bar for us to enact the death penalty. We should want that. We should always demand that it is the highest of our all bars, that there is beyond a shadow of a doubt, that this person has done what they're accused of, and that this is the justice and the consequences of what they did. If there's reasonable doubt, then they shouldn't get the death penalty. I mean, we have that high bar on purpose, so I do support the death penalty, but I also want to see very, very strict high bars. Ben Franklin said it best. He said, ‘I'd rather one guilty go free than 100 innocent be condemned, right?’ I think that's a good thing. I think we want that society where the weight is on the government to prove the guilt, not on the person convicted, to prove their innocence.
Ethan Sandweiss
There was a case in Missouri that has been pretty famous nationally recently, where a man was executed when the prosecutor, former prosecutor, had come out and said this isn't actually a man I think is guilty. Now, if there was a case like that in Indiana, would you urge Governor Braun to pardon a person in that situation?
Micah Beckwith
Well, I think you have to look at each case individually, right? You can't just take one case and apply it broadly. I don't know specifically what that prosecutor was referring to, but I also do know he wasn't the jury of his peers, right? There's a jury that's that is called upon. The prosecutor is just one person. Now, I think it would certainly give pause, I think, if you were the justice system or in the justice system, and the prosecutor comes out later and says, ‘Hey, we might have missed something. I think we need to go back and probably have a very honest, open dialog about, what did we miss here?’ Because again, rather one guilty go free than 100 innocent be condemned. And so we've got to make sure that bar is very, very high. And so I think if there was a case like that in Indiana, I certainly would have my radar on it, and follow it and make sure if I have to be a voice, whether it's in the ear of the governor or to the people, and say, ‘Hey, we might have missed something here,’ I would certainly do that. You know, my heart is to defend those who are defenseless, to fight for those who maybe can't fight for themselves. So I would certainly, you know, I think that would probably play out, you know, pretty passionately, if that were the case.
Ethan Sandweiss
Something that, of course, we cover a lot of here in Bloomington, is university business. And then there was a law that was passed last year, Senate Enrolled Act 202. It's a bill that essentially ties tenure protections to intellectual diversity in the class and put forward alternative viewpoints. What do you see the state's role as in university education?
Micah Beckwith
Well, if it's public education, I think state has a big role to play in that. I mean, if they're getting public funds, then they have a duty to step in say, hey, what's being taught? I mean, we don't want lies being substituted in the place of truth. And you may argue, well, who gets to decide what's true, what's or what's a lie? Well, I think that's where, collectively, as a state, we have to come back to the table as legislators and say, ‘Okay, what's allowed?’ I will tell you this. I think higher academia has become a place where indoctrination reigns supreme. I know conservative students right here at IU that cannot say their conservative viewpoints for fear of getting docked on a grade, being ostracized from extracurricular activities, or losing friendships. And I hear that all the time about IU. I hear that, I mean, you can't be conservative and go to IU at least openly. That's not freedom, that's not tolerance. That is the opposite of that. And yet, we have professors and administrations and places like IU that are saying, if you're conservative, keep it to yourself, but if you're on the left, then I mean, the sky is yours, the floor is yours, and so, so that has to stop. This should be a place where all ideas can be shared and people can welcome the idea, the staff and the professors, the administration, they should welcome this beautiful mosaic of ideas and then let truth play out. And it's not happening. It's not happening at IU, and as colleges across the country are pushing conservative viewpoints aside, and they're doing it intentionally. All of Indiana sees it. I mean, when I travel the state, this is not a secret. You talk about IU most of the time. People say, ‘Oh, yes, you're going to send your kids there to get indoctrinated.’ That's just a fact. Now, IU has an incredible, storied history. I wish it wasn't that way. I wish we weren't indoctrinating our kids at IU, because IU has a huge, storied history where I want it to be the cream of the crop in education, but if we can't have professors and administrations that welcome all thought, then you're not going to be able to get to that, that that beautiful, you know, higher academic learning that I think most of us would say we want for our state, so I think that bill that you're talking about was in response to this egregious, intentional assault on conservative thought in places like IU, and it's happening and all of Indiana sees it. That's why they're electing legislators to go and deal with this so and I hope IU will take some onus on its own, to say, yeah, maybe we have a problem. Let’s do some self-reflection here. Maybe there is an issue. So that way the state doesn't have to step in and fix it, but if they don't, then the state will.
Ethan Sandweiss
How much do you think this is an issue that involves personal perception and anecdotal cases, versus something where it's demonstrably true that students are being persecuted against for their conservative beliefs?
Micah Beckwith
I think it's demonstrably true. I think we've seen that across the board, at IU and other public institutions and schools around the country. There's evidence upon evidence, case upon case. I've got stories of professors that are docking students and telling the students that they are being docked because their conservative viewpoint. It's not because of the content or the way that content was presented. It's literally because of the conservative viewpoint within the content. And so that's I see it. And again, you might say, ‘Okay, well, is it anecdotal?’ Well, how many times do I have to hear the same story from a student that I used to be a youth pastor with, or that a parent that I know who has kids where now they're coming back and they have a completely different worldview perspective, and they're being told like, ‘Hey, you better follow the company line, or else.’ And so, I mean, again, I hear this countlessly all over the state. And so we want this place, we want places like IU to be open to thought. It should be a place where people can bring their ideas and their content and their worldview into this place. And then let's debate it. Let's talk about it. Let's, let's dissect it. And if you get to the point where you can't defend what you believe, then it's either wrong or you don't know enough about what you believe. So I always say I don't shy away from any questions on the on the campaign trail, because if I don't know what I know and know why I know it, then I don't have any business running for office. So I love that iron sharpening iron. So when people of differing opinions and worldviews come at me and they say, ‘Well, what about this? What about that?’ Again, I better know what I know and know why I know it. If not, I need to go back and either study more or I'm wrong and I need to change to align with what the truth is.
Ethan Sandweiss
I think a lot of the professors would argue that they are subject matter experts in their field, and knowing these particular topics is how they got their positions. What would make the legislature more able to determine what is a correct position to take in their classes?
Micah Beckwith
Well, I think the legislature is the voice of the people. So if there are professors that are saying, ‘I'm the expert, legislature, don't tell me what to do,’ what that professor inevitably is doing is telling the people to go shut up and sit down. And if you work at a place like IU, where it is a publicly funded institution, then you have no business as a professor telling the legislature to shut up and sit down, because that is the voice of the people, the same people that that pay your salary, the same people that have enacted this this campus to do what the campus is supposed to be doing. I got this in the library battle, people would say, well, the publishers or the authors are the experts, so you're just a little pastor, you know, from Noblesville. Who are you to say that they're wrong? It's like, listen, I know truth. I know I can speak to what I see as well. And by the way, I'm a pastor, I'm an expert in morality. So you know, I can see these things very clearly. And so it's incumbent upon all of us to speak and to create this state the way that we want it to be. And so when the legislature, the representation, the voice of the people, says to the Indiana University of Indiana, hey, we don't think you're going in necessarily the right direction, then I think it's important that Indiana IU has the humility to say, okay, maybe we need to do some self-reflection and look in the mirror.
Ethan Sandweiss
All right, so talking about Southern Indiana, there’s a lot of different things people do here. I mean, the university is just one of them. There's a lot of farmers, people who work in forestry. What do you think are the major important issues for voters here in southern Indiana?
Micah Beckwith
I think, first of all, I think property taxes is a huge one. I think we're seeing that all over the state. We're seeing that from farming to homeownership to business ownership, property taxes have got to be addressed. And Mike has put out a great plan. I think it will give cover to legislators to now do their job and fix the problem. And so we're already seeing some really, I think substantial plans come from different lawmakers around the state, so I look forward to working with the legislature and with Mike Braun to help people stay in their homes and keep their businesses and keep their family farms. To me, it's just it's egregious that the government thinks it could take somebody's property just because they can't pay taxes after they've lived there for 30 years, and with rising inflation, and you know, they're on fixed income, the government has they think they have the right to go in and take this person's property just because they can't pay the government rent to stay there. That's not what our founders ever envisioned. That's not what our nation should be. And so we've got to fix that on day one. And we'll start working on day one. That's going to be one of the top priorities. And I know it is, too with the legislature, I've talked to a lot of state reps and state senators, you're going to have local units of government that are going to say, ‘Okay, well, what about us?’ Because property taxes is a big way local governments fund themselves. So. There's certainly going to be some common ground that we're going to have to find, but it's doable. We can, I'm confident we can find a solution for everybody. And really quick, could you kind of explain the basics of bronze plan? Yeah. So first it's, it's a 3% growth cap, so you're not going to ever see your property taxes go increase year over year more than 3% so we've seen to give you an example farm. Farmers have seen from last year to this year a 26.1% increase in property taxes. That's crazy. That can't be allowed to happen. So what Braun’s plan does is caps those egregious rate hikes. So if that would have been in place for farmers last year, it wouldn't have been able to go up to 26% the most it could go up would be 3% and that's, I think that's the first thing. There's a 2021 reset, which I think is great, kind of gets us back into some aspect of normal way of life when it comes to this inflation. I mean, Biden has really screwed things up. Biden and Harris have really done big time damage to our economy. And inflation is one of those, one of the ways they've hurt us. But this would help kind of set that back. And so we'll come in and say, ‘Hey, we're going to put it back to those 2021 rates.’ And then I think anytime we see referendums, I think one of the one of the pieces that I know Mike has really been a champion of on the campaign trail is making sure that referendums happen on even years during election cycles, because sometimes you have voter turnout that's as low as 13, 14, 15% in some counties, and there'll be a referendum that increases property taxes, and you have a majority of people that didn't even come out to vote for it. Now you can argue that people need to be more engaged, and I would say absolutely they need to be more engaged. You should never let a vote pass without going to vote. So that's one issue. But the other issue is, let's make sure that we actually are getting the majority voice of the community and putting referendums on years, whether it's even years, it's a little bit more of a voter turnout historically, and that would be one of the crucial pieces, too. So those are a few basic aspects of that plan.
Ethan Sandweiss
A recent political ad put out by Mike Braun showed an AI altered or a photoshopped image from a Jennifer McCormick rally with people holding clients against gas stoves. I think in the original picture, they were holding Jennifer McCormick signs. I mean, where do you stand on use of AI or manipulated images when it comes to political campaigns?
Micah Beckwith
I haven’t seen that,* but I certainly know that's going to be an issue going forward, where we have deepfakes, and I think it's just going to be something we're going to have to wade through the murky waters of that, because I know people have put things out that I've said or photoshopped me in images that I'm not in and we've got to have a good faith effort to you to honesty on both sides of the aisle. So that's to me the number one thing is let's give honest assessments. You can go after your opponents, that's fine, but go after them honestly and in good faith as a way to do that. And I think we're going to have to address this more and more every election cycle. My concern is that it'll just keep getting worse and worse, because AI just keeps getting better and better, and so it's gonna be hard. We're gonna really need the spirit of discernment in Indiana to be able to discern what's really true and what's not. So that'll be something I'll I've always been an advocate for honesty. I tell you what I believe. Anyone can ask me about anything, and I'll be honest with you and then you can decipher what you what you think about it. But to have AI kind of coming in and, you know, putting your image, or putting images around you that that isn't true, then we're gonna, I think the legislature is really gonna have to wade through that with wisdom. Because how do you do that and also protect freedom of expression, right? So there's going to be the argument against coming against AI is, you know, where's the line of the First Amendment in this, right? And so, obviously, I'm a big defender of the First Amendment. And protected speech, that’s the speech that most people are not for. That's why we had to protect it, right? If it were speech everybody agreed with, we wouldn't need the First Amendment. But we have to protect the minority rights in in Indiana and America, because they have got given rights, just like everybody else does. So that's gonna be a complicated issue, but certainly one that we're gonna tackle and we're ready to do so.
*Note: this interview was conducted Sept. 30, the same day Braun released the doctored image.
Ethan Sandweiss
And if somebody put out an image that turned out to be photoshopped or manipulated, would you urge them to take that down?
Micah Beckwith
Well yeah, I mean, and again, I think I'd have to see it. I'd want to see the details, because I know on both sides, there's gonna be people who say, ‘Well, that was manipulated,’ and there's gonna be other people say, ‘Well, no it wasn't.’ So you're gonna have to get to the truth. I mean, even within all these battles that I've seen with AI manipulation already, it's been he said she said. So again, yes, if I found out that this was truly manipulation, and it was something to where people were boldface lying, I would certainly encourage whoever did that to put it back up with the right with the right image or content. But I think that we're going to have to wade through this as a legislature over the next 10 years. It's going to get more and more complicated, for sure, but those are the challenges of the future, but I'm excited to be called to serve and to step in, so that's what we're looking forward to.
